Photographic references. Fess Up!

[JackAnimated]

So, I have trouble painting without them. Does everyone use them? Also, if it is my photo, I enjoy mixing the actual photo with with the painting, painting over it and using overlay in PS. Is it cheating, is it wrong? lol

Any opinions? What do you do, and how do you use photos in your work?

[MarkWinters]

I tend to work as long as I can without the reference, only pulling it out when needed. I would avoid painting over a photograph.

[Elwell]

the Show Us Your Reference thread (http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?t=62796)
the Using Photo Reference Correctly thread (http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?t=123346)

[JackAnimated]

I tend to work as long as I can without the reference, only pulling it out when needed. I would avoid painting over a photograph.

Why? If it achieving the result right.

[cmalidore]

At that point you run a high risk of photo dependency - if you don't directly paint over the photo the brain often has a better chance of being creative. But if you show it a guide - it will often want to use it. So at that point, by referencing it, you are learning and still asserting yourself in a creative manner.

I'd rather be a creative person than making my paintings look exactly like "correct" photos, but it's all subjective. Perhaps I'm a minority that way. Doesn't make it right or wrong really.

[JackAnimated]

Hmmm, interesting. Really I only paint over or manipulate photos when the outcome will be very different. i.e. horror/fantasy character. If I was just going to paint over a photo to make it exactly the same there would be no point.

[Elwell]

There's nothing wrong with photomanips and paintovers, as long as they aren't presented as something else.

[JackAnimated]

There's nothing wrong with photomanips and paintovers, as long as they aren't presented as something else.

Yeah, I think of them as collage/paintings mixed pieces.

[Grief]

think of using a photo sort of like having a math textbook. you know the answers are in the back right? does it make you a cheater if you check the answers? not at all, in fact youre doing yourself a disservice if you don't check to make sure youre doing it right. if you are right, then you know youre on the right path, and if youre wrong maybe you can use the answer to 'reverse engineer' the problem until you can see what you did wrong.

art can be just like this. paintovers, tracing, and photomanipulations can be a great learning tool if used properly. you live in a time when we can seemingly magically overlay the subject we're painting onto our image and see firsthand how close our approximation is to a photo of reality, how sweet is that? do you realize how beneficial that can be to your growth as an artist?

eventually as you progress using these things will not be the most seamless means to create your work, and you'll find that working exclusively from photomanips and tracing will actually limit your ability to properly express your ideas.

i do my fair share of photocollages and images based off of photographs, and i have not recieved one negative comment on conceptart regarding this. this is because i clearly state when i use photos as reference and i tell people what shortcuts i take. i don't have to worry about being 'caught' or anything because i'm not trying to hide my sources. (i don't, of course, link people to the images i use as photo reference, mainly because i don't want kids to go roaming on all the softcore porn sites i visit)

andrew jones, was talking about 'revealing his tricks' on a video clip i saw somewhere. to loosely paraphrase him, he was talking about how at his live shows he pulls out every trick in the book and exposes his process for the crowd. not only do people appreciate to see the honesty of his process, but it also forces him to have to find new ways of creating work in the future as to keep his ideas fresh. of course he isn't tracing or anything, but he is being open with his audience, and i think thats a valuable thing to have if you want to be taken seriously.

the threads elwell linked in his first post are worth reading in regards to fair play. be sure to check those out.

[Dizon]

Here is some helpful advice from James Gurney regarding using photo refs: http://gurneyjourney.blogspot.com/2009/03/using-photo-reference.html