The Grumpy Angry Abusive Art Professor Thread

[XanaChama]

You know what type I'm talking about. The art professor you HATE/HATED during school who tells you everything you don't want to hear, whether it is true or not, who never lets you do it your way, who screams at you during class, who takes you to the side but out in the open and tells you how you're doing badly, how you won't make it, how you can't improve, the list goes on... These are the teachers who either make or break you. I want to discuss your stories about teachers like this who you have encountered... how has it changed your life and affected how you approach your art and did they help or hurt you? I figure everyone has at least one of these experiences.

My story is not so serious (yet), but I will start with my Painting I teacher. I am taking the class now, and so far he has not said anything overly critical to me or made me feel too uncomfortable. Yes, he's embarassed me in front of class, but whatever. I joked about it and blew it off. I had some humor about it, because you can't get everything perfect...

I thought about starting this thread because today my professor decided to unload on some girl in front of everyone using her as an example for his personal "pet peeves". First, he berated the fact she put color on the canvas and wasn't paying real attention to the value of the color she was using... honest mistake for a first time painter IMO, but this was just the beginning. Then he took her palette and was making a big deal about how it was a mess and she had various pools of colors being mixed and wasn't scraping them up with the palette knife and putting them in piles. (So basically her whole palette is a mixing zone).

He didn't like this at all, he spent 3-4 hours last class explaining to us how to both properly color and mix colors, match values, etc. He also discussed our palette with us. And you think, wow he spent that long, you think the girl should've gotten it the first time. But to me, it was a lot of information. Yes, she made a lot of mistakes and she should be responsible for the result. But it kinda started getting ugly towards the end of class.

He pulled her aside and basically in open discussion in the class, he started asking her why she was even there. He said "You have a problem following instructions." (Ouch) The worst part is, when you make a mistake in his class, he blurts it out openly. He'll ask "What classes have you taken? Professor ____ put up with this? He lets you hold a charcoal this way." Which kinda made me snort, because the professor he was criticizing was his boss and the art director at our school. She tried explaining to him that "Well, that's now what he does... he doesn't mind. He lets you do it your way." And this entire time, her voice is getting quieter and he's just going on about how she shouldn't have been allowed to do things this way, or that way. And then he's defending himself in the end, but the way he was doing it as I was listening to his voice while painting, you could tell he was like "Whatever, you're not gonna make it, I don't know who you think you're fooling".

The girl is a bit timid and I've had her for the same classes and I've had the same professors he was complaining about. I don't see how holding a charcoal differently warranted that kind of outburst. Which is probably how it started, basically if you didn't follow his instructions his way, even though he insisted "Well, you can do it however you want, but I'm going to teach you the right way, so I won't say anything further, blah blah blah... (he does)". Basically, he's one of those old fashioned teachers who basically thinks you should have infinite patience, discipline and be immediately infallible as soon as you walk in the class. Yes, he lets you make mistakes. But he makes a damn scene about it, especially if you try to make your own choices about something. So from my POV, I thought he was getting overly personal with this girl, who honestly is too shy and too timid to have been treated like "Oh, you on purpose didn't want to follow instructions"... though she had some balls, she told him "I can do this and this well. I've done that, I've done the stuff you're talking about." But he made it no secret he was having this discussion with her in class.

My friend also started having breathing problems and weakness from her lungs, she thinks because of the spray retouch varnish. She tried to talk to him outside about it (another conversation he lets the whole class hear), and he was making it seem like he'd never heard of someone having a reaction to damar varnish... "Oh, it must not be the spray, it must be this, blah blah. I'm just sayin'. Harhar"

Honestly, I see why he says everything he does and I think it's very critical that you have high standards, so I'm glad that he's not easy on us because it requires so much patience to paint. But on the other hand, I think what happened with the girl was out of line... at least have that discussion with her outside. I mean, I wouldn't care, it won't hurt me if someone heard me. But when you're doing something new and you're not exactly sure how to approach it and feel insecure, don't make it worse by making someone uncomfortable in the class. He has a habit of bringing everyone out into the open and bringing he's personal feelings into the matter over just simply letting people make errors and offering a solution to them. No need to make personal comments about how you think they're insubordinate and talk to them like everything they do outside a class they've never taken before must be a disaster.

For example, I really like how he gave her financial advice when she mentioned wanting to go to MICA in Baltimore. (a VERY expensive art school, but still). "Oh, with your problems, why would you waste the money?" Great professor, knows what he's talking about, but needs to get over himself alittle.

Ok, I'm done ranting. Anyone else have any stories?

[B u r l]

i had my harshest teacher a few years ago. i bumped into him last year and he opened the conversation with "your heads round and you've gotten fatter" which is always nice to hear. you can imagine how he was with the art critiques. he's just about the bluntest, honest bastard possible. when he got annoyed he used to make people cry in front of the class by slating into them / their work. he always liked my work so i mostly had it easy on that side, with the exception of a few burns. really, i like the ones like him who cut the bullshit. i'd rather a teacher just tell me if something's crap or not, rather than dance around the issue as to not offend.

i think people need a good cutting into. it get's your ass in gear and makes you thicker skinned.

[Undertow]

That's not being a teacher and there's no excuse for that level of douchebaggery. Then again, you'll run into those kinds of instructors in schools everywhere. You're paying for your education, it's your right to request a different instructor or at least alert the department head to this guys behavior. Have you tried talking to the department head about him yet?

[XanaChama]

That's not being a teacher and there's no excuse for that level of douchebaggery. Then again, you'll run into those kinds of instructors in schools everywhere. You're paying for your education, it's your right to request a different instructor or at least alert the department head to this guys behavior. Have you tried talking to the department head about him yet?

That's the tricky thing. It's one of those professors that has been there so long, that the classmates who are like 60 took him aeons ago. Hell, we've had models who have been modeling that long (but that's not common fortunately). He was some old guy and one of the older students brought in a painting he painted of him 13 years ago. And the class he modeled for is the same class I am in now (same professor).

I'm sure it's been brought up before. My art director will suggest certain teachers to students if he or they find they can't handle certain traits or if another teacher might be better suited for them. Our art director is a really awesome guy (and an extraordinary painter who people know by name), so I find it kinda weird that the Painting teacher would ask questions like that, but that isn't the first time he's asked if that other professor taught his students to "do things properly". It's not like this is the first Painting I class he's ever taught, both professors have been at the same school for a long time.

And despite all this, he does know what he's talking about. I have a thicker skin, so I don't really let it bother me. In fact, if he says something to me, I'm probably more likely to either take what he says seriously or tell him flat out why I disagree with it. But for most students, a professor like that is complete hell. And I'm probably only OK with it because I want to learn Painting that bad. I probably wouldn't have taken him eitherwise... especially after my friend told me that in the Drawing I class he teaches, he told a female student that "You just think your good looks alone will get you through this course"... I mean, that's just deplorable.

Great teacher. Not sure I could have a cup of coffee with him and deal with his self infatuation. You may be extraordinarily experienced, but that doesn't give you a right to be an asshole.

Edit: And despite what he says about the other professor. It is his not his nature to tell people how to use their tools. He shows his students and gives very thorough demonstrations, but it's up to the student whether they want to listen to him or not. He'll stop them and tell them not to do something a certain way if they're having problems, but if your work looks good, he won't give suggestions... 99% of the time, he will suggest something to improve, you're not impervious to criticism.

[Noah Bradley]

I really despise when instructors resort to personal insults (I've had some like that) to get their message across. But in the end even they're better than the incompetent/useless ones who won't teach you a thing.

[XanaChama]

I really despise when instructors resort to personal insults (I've had some like that) to get their message across. But in the end even they're better than the incompetent/useless ones who won't teach you a thing.

Very very true.

Edit: Anyone else?

[onionface]

sounds like a passionate tutor to me. an arsehole maybe, but he cares about art. everybody knows fixitive is bad for you. people should spray it out the window, or outdoors. my brothers tutor would take a knife to paintings he didn't like.

I had too extremes myself, got the highest marks for art in one school went to another and got the lowest. the second teacher was an abstract sculpturor, a bad one at that she did no drawing/painting or figure sculpture you can imagine the agruements I had about what constitutes being an artist, or having a talent. From my previous school I where art history is half the grade I learnt enough that I was correcting the teacher of the second school. She kept throwing me out of class for being disruptive as she called it. she sid the age old teacher thing to once,"if you so smart why don't you teach the class" I said okay and walked up to the front I said,"we arn't doing abstract anymore we are going to learn about anotomy" she went off crying and got the HOD. I got a talking to.

[madster]

Sounds like an over egotistical, abusive jerk to me.

Here's a BIG newsflash, if you are PAYING to go to class, you are enabling this jerk. Even if it is a high school instructor, the "Hell's Kitchen" form of abusive education is neither necessary nor should it be tolerated. PARTICULARLY when YOU are paying to be abused...

You are PAYING to learn art, not to be publicly ridiculed, and have previous education insulted.
At the very least, document every incident, and approach a councellor or the dept. dean, WITH your list of at least 3-5 incidents (date, time, and names of parties). If YOU get abused like this, double the importance to say something.

Idiots like this give art and art instruction a bad name, and are the living proof of the old adage "Them that can't do, teach." Don't believe it, and don't be a victim. Just as you need to spead your artistic soul through your art, so do you need to not allow yourself to be abused. Screaming at you in public is uncalled for. By anyone. Period.

~M

[XanaChama]

Sounds like an over egotistical, abusive jerk to me.

Here's a BIG newsflash, if you are PAYING to go to class, you are enabling this jerk. Even if it is a high school instructor, the "Hell's Kitchen" form of abusive education is neither necessary nor should it be tolerated. PARTICULARLY when YOU are paying to be abused...

You are PAYING to learn art, not to be publicly ridiculed, and have previous education insulted.
At the very least, document every incident, and approach a councellor or the dept. dean, WITH your list of at least 3-5 incidents (date, time, and names of parties). If YOU get abused like this, double the importance to say something.

Idiots like this give art and art instruction a bad name, and are the living proof of the old adage "Them that can't do, teach." Don't believe it, and don't be a victim. Just as you need to spead your artistic soul through your art, so do you need to not allow yourself to be abused. Screaming at you in public is uncalled for. By anyone. Period.

~M

The only problem I have with that argument is that it probably is not a bad opportunity to gain a thicker skin. I mean, everywhere you go, you're going to have people who are supreme assholes who you can barely tolerate. Better to learn to deal with it then complain every time it gets a little uncomfortable. So am I supposed to drop every class that has a jerk teaching it? Now, that doesn't mean I have to put up with it... a person like that would not get away with treating me that way, I may be a nice little laid back woman, but I'm fricken oil and water when it comes to that kind of thing and you know that when you deal with me.

The moment it interferes with my education though, then we're singing a different tune. I took this class (and chose to put up with him) because I wanted to learn to paint that badly. I could give two shits about his ego problem. So for me, if it makes no real difference, why would I need to drop the course? I won't lie and say I haven't considered what you feel though... I don't like watching other people get berated. The only reason I didn't say anything is because she handled it well... if I thought telling him what I thought about his behavior would have any effect, I would've said something to him in person. But his argument would be "Well the way I see it..." and how can you argue with a moron like that?

And please, anyone feel free to post their stories. This is stuff everyone puts up with in art school. (Well in my case, college :/)

[TASmith]

the worst is an abusive teacher who's also incompetent, with no solid information to give.

[Straight Edge Ryan]

One thing I hate seeing is when people seem to feel like their talent, intelligence or position in life gives them a right to be an ass. Look, I don't care who you are, what you've done, how much money you have, how famous you are, or how talented you are, you don't have a right to act like a dickhole for no reason. Period.

I think it's good for people to be blunt, it's good not to tip-toe around things with unnecessary pleasantries, and yes sometimes calling someone out like that can in fact help them a lot. I know for a fact that there have been times teachers made personal information very public to the class and as a result I shaped up, that doesn't mean I'm 100% happy about it, but it did serve a purpose. But spending all that time because a girl "isn't holding charcoal the right way" or because "her palette is messy" is nothing but being a pedantic ass, eager to flaunt your self indulgent "knowledge".

I hate when people make rules or act like certain techniques are set in stone. If he thinks she would benefit from trying something different, then he should tell her so, but he should suggest it and not order it. Besides, the only right way to do your artwork is the way that works best for you. If your work is better when you do things a less "conventional" way then that's how you should do it. To hell with what's "proper"

[the ANGRY filipino]

the worst is an abusive teacher who's also incompetent, with no solid information to give.


Amen to that! I had this real asshole of a teacher who used to reprimand me for drawing creatures and stuff..saying that i was letting "western art" influence me too much and that art should always reflect the problems of society..which meant that naked barbarian babes and dragons were not welcome in his class..he said it didn't matter if the anatomy was right as long as your message was there..
I remember always trying to piss him off by adding a couple of horns and sometimes a third eye to any portraiture assignment he had us do. Or the time when he had us draw cars from life, and I added tentacles and dead mangled people underneath it..
And his only way to teach his students how to draw the human head was..'draw an egg shape"..for a whole fucking year thats the only technique he had his students do..no lessons on planes of the head, structure etc..just draw a fucking egg..

yeah, basically i wasted my college life in a shitty artschool with stuck up, deluded professors..who were only considered as amazing artists by their circle of likeminded friends..thank you guys for wasting my life!
I have learned more from CA than my whole time with you and I wish i could take that time of my life back!
note: not that all teachers are lousy or losers..teaching is a noble proffession, its jerks like these who give teaching a bad name.

[Sorknes]

I had a mathematics teacher I hated with all my guts. He would purposedly get me into debates in classes, I was a hot head, he was a hot head, and we'd go circles until one of us had proven the other wrong.

He always backed off when I'd proven him wrong though. And now I love what he did, he explained it to me later too. I was a lazy ass "floating on my grades" kind of student back then, and the way he made me think made me jump leaps later - not to mention I went further in maths at that point than I'd prolly done if I just kept floating. I also got told later by some other students that our fights in the classroom really learnt them more since things would be explained several times over with different approaches which made it stick better for them. At the end of the year people would jump into our heated debates with their own points of views and approaches.

He never ever went personal though. And I think that if he had a serious problem with me being an idiot or doing something that really needed to be straightened out he'd take the debate somewhere else. I know he did with a couple of others. There's a difference between someone making you think or push you "off the cliffs" to get you realising stuff and someone that's just a total douchebag. If you pay for your education you should not take personal abuse in any way. His way made my skin tons thicker, learnt me think and see things from other viewpoints, and learning me that my own way not necessarily was the best way, but it was a big part of learning. You don't need abuse to get thick skin, professional attitude from your teachers can give you that anwyay.

I had another teacher in computer stuff, which was not only an idiot, she was hopelessly outdated, and when I pointed something out in class it made her have a personal grudge against me which ended up showing on my grades and she would "loose" my tests. Really bad blood going on there. I had quarrels with her too, but I took that issue to the schools leaders, and after that year she was no longer a teacher. I kept writing down what happened, and got other students vouch for me. As said, there's a difference.

[Grief]

stop complaining.

you love art right? youre fortunate enough to be in art school, not many people get the chance to experience formal education on what they want to pursue in life.

this is college, grow up. people will be mean in life. you will disagree with others throughout your career. consider this practice. if he put a hand on you then its a different issue, but mere verbal assualt is such a non-issue that it barely causes me to arch an eyebrow anymore.

i dealt with an array of professors in my half deacde in college. some of the most important things i learned came from the most moronic socially awkward assholes. they taught me how not to behave just watching them act as the natural dickweeds they were. you can learn from a fool, lest you be doomed to repeat his folly. remember that well.

don't be shy to question their actions and voice your own opinions. don't just learn what to do. ask why. if something seems arbitrary and pointless speak up. you will not always be afforded the opportunity to argue with people who are passionate and know their stuff, so don't miss out on it. take what they say with a grain of salt so that you may weigh it against what other professors will teach you, as it will most certainly contradict what someone else will teach you as 'the only way'.

and really do you want to go to a school where everything is easy and everyone agrees with you? where's the fun in that? there would be no challenge or opposition to truly enforce your foundation. you'd be dough ready to be beaten by life the second you step out of the school. these jerkoffs are professionals at being agrivating and frusterating, you won't find better assholes for your dollar to toughen your resolve.

you will encounter hypocrites and talentless windbags, layered beneath their bullshit may lie a strand or two of logic and wisdom, make sure you don't leave the school without taking their meager offering.

[ruzkard]

One school that is full of instructors like this is the Art Institute of Orange County in California. There are atleast two teachers for every course you take, one is easygoing but still knows there stuff and the other is an overly critical jerk. The worst instructor that I had encountered was for a sculpture class. I openly admit that I can't sculpt to save my life, but I figured I might learn something and be able to gain a new skill set. Boy was I wrong. The first day of class I realized that I would be struggling to maintain a passing grade. The instructor told us stories about how he has made people cry (not just girls) in the middle of class based on his critiques, but the best part was when someone asked if he could provide any tutorials or give us some hints on how to approach sculpting an object he replied, " I can't teach you how to sculpt, you just have to figure it out while you're doing it." WTF?! What kind of answer is that? If thats the case then why is there a teacher for that subject? Even most of the other instructors and administrators new he was a jerk and a horrible teacher. That being said there were several other teachers who were a little tough but they are definitely masters when it came to the subject they were teaching. One such instructor is even a member on this site, Charles Hu (aka hufigure) is one of the best teachers I had while attending that school and I highly recommend that anyone who needs help with their anatomy subscribe to his thread: http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120175

[Kamikazebob]

Ilaekae is not in this thread. It is not grumpy enough.
:ilaekae:

[Undertow]

stop complaining.

you love art right? youre fortunate enough to be in art school, not many people get the chance to experience formal education on what they want to pursue in life.

this is college, grow up. people will be mean in life. you will disagree with others throughout your career. consider this practice. if he put a hand on you then its a different issue, but mere verbal assualt is such a non-issue that it barely causes me to arch an eyebrow anymore.
Grief, this is not acceptable behavior from any instructor. I'm not talking about being politically correct or touchy feely. I'm talking about the environment that this teacher has created for some of his students is one of cynicism and resignation. For most people, if they were to walk into a classroom everyday wondering when they were going to be made a fool of, their level of interaction with the class would be diminished. They'd be less inclined to ask questions or try to interact with the instructor, in turn not getting as much from their education as they could.

Everyone is wired differently based upon their life experiences. You may not have a problem confronting people like this however, there is another portion of the population that will. Students should be encouraged to succeed and not dissuaded from achieving success with their own work. If 2 instructors contradict each other, as they often do, it should be made clear that there is no right or wrong way to do it, just a particular preference that the instructor has and that as long as the student is in their class they will do things their way. Discrediting another professor like that is extremely unprofessional.

[JessiBean]

I know people want to vent things out, but do remember, this is an internet forum, and LOTS of people see these things. Including potential employers, Art Directors, maybe even people from your school or the professor in question. All the name calling generally makes you look bad more than them.

Watch who you are trashing and how much you are trashing your own reputation in the process.

If you have a serious concern about a professor's behavior or treatment of students, take that up with your student advisor or an administrator at the school, in a polite and private manner.
:^^:

[J Wilson]

I gotta go with Grief on this one. I didn't hear anything in the account that sounded to ME to be over the top. If there was a personal insult like "You are fat and ugly" that would be wrong, but if the statement is "You are being lazy," or "You haven't listened to a damn thing I said, so why are you here?" those are valid statements. Blunt, sure, but valid, and there's a good chance that someone needed to hear it.

You don't pay for abuse, but you do pay for an education, and sometimes you just gotta be really friggen blunt to get through to people.

One of the "scariest" teachers I ever had was my college english instructor. He would yell, scream, and throw desks (literally). He freaked people out. Later, you found out the entire thing was an act, a semi made up character that got people's attention (because there was no way in hell you were going to let that guy call on you for an answer and prove you hadn't been paying attention). Those of us who "got it" (what he was doing) quickly grew to love him for the entertainment value of what he was doing. And we friggen learned the fuck out of english!

Back to art teachers though, I say grow a thick skin now, because art directors will be pretty direct too, if you make similar mistakes with not following directions or not doing work that is up to par. You have 4 short years of art school to learn the basics of a very complicated subject. When in class, you aren't there to do things "your way". A student shouldn't have a "your way" yet, because if you knew what the hell you were doing you wouldn't need to be there. Do it their way. Learn what they are trying to teach you, and appreciate that they are passionate enough about the subject to be forceful.

EDIT- If learning their way gives you a result that is nothing like what you want to do, then that's a valid reason to seek out another instructor (or school). But if they are in effect teaching you what you want to learn, then you owe it to yourself to put your own methods aside and follow their lead.

[spaztastic]

I agree with j wilson and grief. Most people going into college still have the stigma of High school, where basically they can do what ever they want and get away with it. College is not a game, you go there because you want to learn, period end of discussion. Other wise you are wasting your time, the professors time and every one else's. These instructors have had to put up with shit for many years, from deluded children thinking they will still get away with school boy antics of high school, or using their daddies money to get there way. So when the teachers treat you like an adult, take it like an adult. It'll help you grow and learn. Like already said if they take it to you personally then do something, i.e if they are truly out to get you not just because you get hurt feelings.

disclaimer...
when i use the word "you"... it doesn't imply the OP or any one else for that matter.... my english and grammar have gotten so bad since I graduated... that I have forgotten many of the correct words to use.

[XanaChama]

This is great that you guys are replying and discussing "not to let it get to me", this is a valuable information and I mean that. But I'm not sure if some of you are replying directly to me or if something is being misread here, but I addressed what was just discussed here... or at least what I think was discussed. I'm not sure if you guys are replying to me or in general, I'm a bit lost. Please make this clear the next time you reply what particular comments you are addressing so people can know what you're talking about. I know some of you mentioned my post, but I already said I had no intention to quit the class and that in reality it does not effect me personally at all. My reaction to madster's comment about that should have made that clear.

Also, keep in mind not everyone will agree with you. Just because that is how you perceive it is the best way to deal with things, doesn't mean another person agrees with them. I started this thread for other people to write their stories/thoughts, so I just want to make sure nobody else feels discouraged from doing so. Everyone has a right to their opinion.

So, does anyone else have something to share? Would like to hear more...

[TASmith]

If this guy's tenured and well respected, there's not much you can do. Even if your entire class protested him, it probably wouldn't go anywhere. Either continue with him or find a new professor, and then drop it, or complaining could come back to haunt you. Whether you're right doesn't matter. What matters is how speaking out could effect you're school career.

[Sady]

When you are young your teachers punish you. When you grow up, if you have not learned to punish yourself, you have learned nothing.

[XanaChama]

EDIT- If learning their way gives you a result that is nothing like what you want to do, then that's a valid reason to seek out another instructor (or school). But if they are in effect teaching you what you want to learn, then you owe it to yourself to put your own methods aside and follow their lead.

I think everyone should take that comment into consideration before they make a decision to drop any class for mundane personal reasons.

[J Wilson]

XanaChama, speaking for my comments, I meant them as a general discussion on loud scary instructors. From how I understand your story, you were a fly on the wall so to speak, watching an instructor rail on a student in front of the class.

You seem uncomfortable with his methods. For all I know there is TONS of subtext in what he said and did that would change my opinion of the situation. As I read the story I was reminded of a couple of the gruff instructors I had, which I loved because they taught me more than any other. For all I know though, the teacher you mention may be an unhappy bully pushing around art students because he's frustrated with his own failures. Who knows.

So my post was only meant to be a possible alternate view on the situation- don't dismiss his statements because you dislike the delivery (a general statement posed to all art students).

[zachalicious]

sometimes Carl yells at us.

[XanaChama]

XanaChama, speaking for my comments, I meant them as a general discussion on loud scary instructors. From how I understand your story, you were a fly on the wall so to speak, watching an instructor rail on a student in front of the class.

You seem uncomfortable with his methods. For all I know there is TONS of subtext in what he said and did that would change my opinion of the situation. As I read the story I was reminded of a couple of the gruff instructors I had, which I loved because they taught me more than any other. For all I know though, the teacher you mention may be an unhappy bully pushing around art students because he's frustrated with his own failures. Who knows.

So my post was only meant to be a possible alternate view on the situation- don't dismiss his statements because you dislike the delivery (a general statement posed to all art students).

Ok, then disregard my comments. From now on I'll just assume that everyone is replying generally unless they "quote" my comments or point that out. Not a big deal.

You're right I was a fly on the wall. When we've communicated directly, from what I can tell, it's just an overinflated ego problem. As long as he figures there's a logical reason to say what he does, then he just says it without any remorse. Like the crazy old grannies and grandpas that I used to have to deal with when my grandmother worked in a nursing home. Seems to be old fashioned behavior IMO... :/

IMHO I think, for a lot of students, that can be difficult to deal with. Especially if the student is a first timer, who has insecurities about their skill and has things going on in their lives that could be changes for them personally or whatnot that affect how they receive or process criticism. I figure mostly everyone doesn't have it completely straight at that age, but not everyone is at that point where they're completely comfortable with that.

At the end of the day, when he's tried getting under my skin, I can still communicate with him about my progress and ask him questions. He may not always respond the way I would prefer or he might not like my question or he might go bat-shit insane, but he does usually answer the question. And he if does give me a hard time about answering it, I let him know why I want to know and I ask him to clarify in certain areas. Or I give him an opportunity to teach me first before I ask too many questions. And honestly, sometimes it's funny to watch him overreact... he can be outright whacko about some of the silliest subjects and it is an example of what not to be in life. Would rather gain a thicker skin and learn to deal with a broader set of people in the process... it's good for me anyway.

With this girl though, I would say she might be at that point that it could hinder her education. He will bully you if he doesn't like you. But whether that's justified is open to interpretation. I understand where he's coming from with his criticism, but I don't think that gives him a ticket to treat someone however he wants. But he does have a point about her messy palette. The charcoal thing was kind of ridiculous, because not everyone holds a pencil or charcoal the same. Should not limit education to only "one way".

Ok, I have said my piece. I'm somewhat surprised that nobody else has taken an opportunity to post about their crappy professors. Might be a survival technique. Or at least a good rant, everyone loves a good rant.

[Flake]

There are plenty of crappy professor posts, I believe the thread was called "Art school horror tales" or similar..

Edit: here's the first one I found but I'm sure there are more in the archives..this one is more "Nightmare Art School Roommate hell" than "Art School Prof Horror"..Keep digging though.
http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?t=103188&highlight=horror

[Dimension]

During my second semester of artsy fartsy art school my sculpture teacher asked me to leave his all abstract sculpture class which was mandatory if you wanted to graduate the fine arts program. He said I showed no interest (true), but at least I completed the assignments and was passing. I just wanted to learn my anatomy and do some fucking figure sculptures, not build shit out of forks and make casts of my face. I didn't say a word and left. I would have let him have it now, or at least asked him why he thought I showed no interest and would have of course laced it with some explicit language. I just didn't know enough at the time. I went and bought some art books after that, then went home and did some anatomy and animal studies. I quit the rest of my classes in the coming weeks. Best decision I've ever made.

How about this. "I've noticed you show no interest in my class, why? Is it because I don't teach representational sculpture? I realize abstraction isn't for everyone and I'm not qualified to teach representational sculpting and there are no atelier type schools on the west coast of Canada. Maybe we could come up with some alternative assignments and maybe I could get some guest lecturers to come in." Instead I get the "You idiots and your representational art, get the hell out of my class" and him taking my non interest as a personal assault. WTF???

Still gets me going when I think about it :P

[nonie]

It actually sounds like the guy knows what he's talking about... Considering value and keeping your palette organized are actually pretty damn important. My harshest art teacher ever was the one who taught me BY FAR the most. Unless art is just a hobby for someone, no they CAN'T just do things "their own way" until they've got a real thorough understanding of what the rules are and why they work. Plus, by being in his class you're agreeing to do things his way because it's the only way you can learn from him. And when he's correcting someone in front of others, yeah it can be embarrassing but then the other students have a chance to learn from it too.

The harsh ones, as long as they know what they're talking about, are BY FAR the best teachers you will get. Supportive and kind teachers are just letting you be weak and slow, and it's not how the real world works. If you hate them because they're incompetent that's one thing, but when the theory is good, put your wounded feelings aside and listen. You can vent later, but spend your class time learning. An abrasive but skilled teacher is better than one who just pats you on the back for participating.

Art directors and clients aren't nice either, and they certainly don't just let you do what you feel like the way you feel like doing it.

That said, venting is ok. Just remember to learn from the guy, you're lucky to have him teaching you.

[Elwell]

But on the other hand, I think what happened with the girl was out of line... at least have that discussion with her outside.
He may or may not be the jerk you've made him out to be, but consider; having that discussion once in public may save him from having it many times in private. Ten will get you twenty everybody has their palettes organized properly next class.
For example, I really like how he gave her financial advice when she mentioned wanting to go to MICA in Baltimore. (a VERY expensive art school, but still). "Oh, with your problems, why would you waste the money?"

Honestly, this sounds like good advice.

[~Faust~]

My driving-instructor yelled at me all the time. I swear I never learned as much from anybody as from that guy.

[Demonique768]

I didn't like my driving instructor too. "Dad I AM WATCHIN THE ROAD!!!"

arg sorry for the caps.. i still get mad

[Kman.]

sounds like a great teacher to me. Wish my painting teacher taught us how to mix on the palette.

[Jason Rainville]

I wonder where all these terrible teachers come from. I've had some dim-witted teachers, unorganized ones, ones that I knew were teaching with only half their asses and others and others who failed to inspire, but I've never had horribly over the top MEAN teachers, nor have I had completely incompetent ones.

Must have got a lucky break. :shrug:

[Earendil]

This kind of reminds me of a story Randy Pausch told in his "Last Lecture" about his football coach. I'm paraphrasing, but during one practice his coach was really hard on him, constantly correcting him, etc. Afterwards, his assistant said "that's a good thing he's doing that." He said that "If you're screwing up and the people watching you aren't telling you, that's a very bad place to be. It means they gave up." Your critics are the ones who are telling you they still care.

[mobile-513]

I had a teacher like that in High School. It was probably the only worthwhile thing I got out of my Catholic school education. He'd find something to just crap on with every drawing I did. He'd always look for ways to say I didn't follow the rules of the assignment and fail me (to his credit, he was probably right at least half the time). It really stressed me the fuck out, probably too much. I got really good though, he really pushed me to express myself, and my life drawing got really loose, intense and confident. Being able to do this is probably the biggest help from a teacher I ever got. On the other hand, I became hyper critical of my work, and am to this day. I have periods where I don't even want to draw, and I'm afraid to try anything remotely complicated.

Most other teachers I've had have had very little to say, much to my disappointment. And yes, a little intense-burning-criticism is good for an artist.


One of the "scariest" teachers I ever had was my college english instructor. He would yell, scream, and throw desks (literally). He freaked people out. Later, you found out the entire thing was an act, a semi made up character that got people's attention...

Dude, did you go to Paier?