80's post-punk/old school goth

[Elwell]

(Spun off from the Your Most Hated Band (http://www.conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?t=117934) thread...)


A band that i dont really hate, just that i dont find the reason to like is The cure. I bet a lot of people here like them but i dont really get it, what is so special about them? :shrug: i try but i just think i will never see it.
You had to be there...

[Renegade89]

You had to be there...

That must be it, i guess is not the same listening the songs now than being part of the scene back then.

[Coinpurse]

lets talk about awesome bands

I heard this was Elwells favorite ;)
heeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

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[Elwell]

I heard this was Elwells favorite ;)
heeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

No, I was gothier than that.
Although I did have that haircut.

[Flake]

No, I was gothier than that.
Me too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWvOHT0zfXY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuezNswtRfo

Tricia and generally spooky chicks ftw. :)

[Coinpurse]

ughhh SoM....

Flake you just gave me nightmares once again. I dreaded listening to that.... do you understand what it is to have no choice but to listen to your older brothers music collection? Granted I was really young but my ears still bleed from time to time.

[Flake]

Inflicting your questionable musical taste on younger family members was tradition back then, or an old charter or something..
If I have to listen to dad playing "Queen- Greatest hits" in the car for three years, damn sure little bro is going to deal with Megadeth and Suicidal Tendencies..

Kids these days with their mp3 players, spoiled I tell ya.

[Kagemusha22]

You had to be there...

And the people who were in the know listened to Joy Division, and Gang Of Four instead. Not that The Cure is bad, I really like "Disintegration", but The Cure is probably one of the weaker Post-Punk bands that was around.

Didn't Robert Smith have an on-going feud with Morrissey?

[tomwaits4noman]

And the people who were in the know listened to Joy Division, and Gang Of Four instead. Not that The Cure is bad, I really like "Disintegration", but The Cure is probably one of the weaker Post-Punk bands that was around.

Didn't Robert Smith have an on-going feud with Morrissey?

yip "He was constantly saying horrible things about [The Cure]," Smith sniffs to Entertainment Weekly. "In the end, I kind of snapped and started retaliating. And it turned into some kind of petty feud. I've never liked anything he's done musically, but I don't have any kind of strong feelings of animosity towards him as a person because I've never met him."

out of the UK post punk bands think Joy Division, Magazine and The Birthday Party were among the best

never got into Gang of Four or Wire.

[Kagemusha22]

yip "He was constantly saying horrible things about [The Cure]," Smith sniffs to Entertainment Weekly. "In the end, I kind of snapped and started retaliating. And it turned into some kind of petty feud. I've never liked anything he's done musically, but I don't have any kind of strong feelings of animosity towards him as a person because I've never met him."

out of the UK post punk bands think Joy Division, Magazine and The Birthday Party were among the best

never got into Gang of Four or Wire.

The Birthday Party were an Australian band, who'd moved to the UK. For me my favourites would be The Fall, Joy Division, and Gang of Four. I also have some stuff from Public Image Ltd., but they're bit much for me.

[tomwaits4noman]

The Birthday Party were an Australian band, who'd moved to the UK. For me my favourites would be The Fall, Joy Division, and Gang of Four. I also have some stuff from Public Image Ltd., but they're bit much for me.

True they were but they came London as The Boys next door they had one minor hit called Shivers written by Roland Howard they changed their name to Birthday Party on moving to UK and were seen as being very much part of the UK post punk scene. Maybe I should said UK based

btw their Peel sessions cd is quite good as is Joy Divisions

[Kagemusha22]

True they were but they came London as The Boys next door they had one minor hit called Shivers written by Roland Howard they changed their name to Birthday Party on moving to UK and were seen as being very much part of the UK post punk scene. Maybe I should said UK based

btw their Peel sessions cd is quite good as is Joy Divisions

Ah I didn't know that.

Yeah considered getting the John Peel Sessions collections by The Fall, but I'm gonna have to wait for a part-time job to come through first. (I do have "This Nation's Saving Grace", "Imperial Wax Solvent", and "The Frightening and Wonderful World of...")

Of Joy Divsion I have their two official albums and that mixed bag "Substance". (Isn't "Still" considered the compilation to get?)

[Elwell]

And the people who were in the know listened to Joy Division, and Gang Of Four instead. Not that The Cure is bad, I really like "Disintegration", but The Cure is probably one of the weaker Post-Punk bands that was around.

People who were "in the know" listened to a lot of stuff :rolleyes:. The Cure didn't break big until several years after Joy Division and GoF had already passed. In 79/80, nobody was listening to the Cure.
And yes, the Birthday Party Peel Sessions are a thing of brilliance.

[arttorney]

Early early stuff I don't seem to grow tired of: "Spirits" by Bauhaus (and Terror Couple Kill Colonel), Warm Leatherette (by The Normal), a lot of Siouxie and the Banshees :punkgirl:(a lot of the lyrics here remind me of the discussion of surrealism from last week e.g. Now she's in purple, now she's a turtle ... disintegrating), The Ramones (just plain fun).

Mid eighties- I have a version of Funkadafi by Front 242 that I like (though I don't like every version of it I have heard), I'm kinda sorry Tones on Tail didn't last, Skinny Puppy, Front Line Assembly.

Later- I was fond of KMFDM, Jesus and Mary Chain, and My Life With the Thrill Kill Cult. "Colours" (Floodland 1988 ) by Sisters of Mercy is still suitably brooding after all this time.

[jubjubjedi]

What? Nobody has mentioned Christian Death, Cocteau Twins, or just about anything released through 4AD during the mid to late 80's?

[Eric Lofgren]

Some of the bands what were commanding my dollars and time back in the day. Man, is this thread ever taking me back to some dangerous times :)

Sorry, imbecile that I am I still don't know how to embed Youtube content

Simple Minds- Love Song
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsOUja8trtA

The Fixx- Deeper and Deeper
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIi79BHQ1ps

Squeeze- Tempted
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUA7F9j_xzs

The Cult- She Sells Sanctuary
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pieI3ctfMfM&feature=related

[DavePalumbo]

Some love for The Wipers? Does it get any better than "When It's Over" off of Youth of America? I don't know if it does.

[KingUnicorn]

This thread is a good way to close out the day:

Xymox - The Stranger
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Bauhaus - She's in Parties
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Fields of the Nephilim - And There Will Your Heart Be Also
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Sisters of Mercy - Ribbons
JJofjSFYZeE

~KU

[Kagemusha22]

Here's my bare-essentials;

PiL - Public Image
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Joy Division - New Dawn Fades
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The Fall - Gut of the Quantifier (Love how Mark has to shout at the band, to get them to play the song)
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Gang of Four - To Hell with Poverty
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[tomwaits4noman]

I am going to throw Magazine into the thread...

Another Manchester band similar vein to Joy Division but more poppier. though their second album Secondhand daylight is almost as dark and brooding as Joy Divisions Closer.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwKv3H9WAkY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Om0jhPkOwhg

they don't get much love but look at the guys in the band,

Howard Devoto Ex Buzzcocks member
Barry Adamson Ex Nick Cave and Bad seeds member and composer and solo artist (his first two albums are gems)
John McGeoch who played with Visage, The Armoury Show, Public Image Ltd., and Siouxsie & the Banshees.

and if US post punk is not off limits Talking Heads and Patti Smith Group are worthy mentions btw if you ever get the chance to see Patti Smith live GO

also Crime and the City Solution (imagine featuring Mick Harvey and Roland S Howard as well as Alex Hacke

goth music never got into the closest I got was Marilyn Manson when I was 16... which is not very close at all.

btw notice a lot bands nicking or sorry influenced by post punk sounds and selling it to the youth of today....

examples Bloc Party, Franz Ferdinand, also Manic Street Preachers (with album Holy Bible anyway - but that was released in 1994)

rather than spam post I'll edit and add

yeah I suppose Sonic Youth funny thing was I always felt they were more a continuation of what Velvet Underground were doing.
I was not dissing Manic Holy Bible, it is an amazing album I listened to it religiously (no pun intended) when I was in college

First Franz album has bittersweet memories for me

My Bloody Valentine sweet... gutted that I missed the chance to see them live, Loveless may be one of the greatest albums ever made... I heard they were handing out free ear plugs at the gigs in London

also adding Television and R.E.M - IRS YEARS (forget the band that signed to Warners and became crap after Automatic for the People) They were a direct product of UK and US post punk crossed with folk West Coast rock bands of 60's.

[Kagemusha22]

and if US post punk is not off limits Talking Heads and Patti Smith Group are worthy mentions btw if you ever get the chance to see Patti Smith live GO

btw notice a lot bands nicking or sorry influenced by post punk sounds and selling it to the youth of today....

examples Bloc Party, Franz Ferdinand, also Manic Street Preachers (with album Holy Bible anyway - but that was released in 1994)

How about the likes of Sonic Youth, for US Post-Punk bands too.

Oh c'mon Bloc Party, Franz Ferdinand, and the Manics aren't that bad. (Though I guess I'm biased, when I consider "The Holy Bible" one of my fave albums...)

Also noticed mention of Jesus & the Mary Chain, Coceatu Twins, and now I've added Sonic Youth to the pot. Might as well embed a video by My Bloody Valentine;

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[Aly Fell]

Cool thread!

The Cure were great! I saw them in the eighties when Robert Smith was still part timing it in Siouxsie and the Banshees. However I was never a Cure nut. Everybody at college was either Cure or The Smiths or even The Jesus and Mary Chain. The bands I went everywhere after were Hawkwind (hardly Goth, but alot of people I knew loved them) and Fields of the Nephilim. I was a big fan of the Leeds scene too, The March Violets, Sisters of Mercy (what is wrong with Andrew Eldritch?), Red Lorry Yellow Lorry. But I got into the post industrial scene with bands like Coil.

Peel sessions were great, listening to John Peel under my covers on a transistor!

[arttorney]

Those must have been interesting times. Mostly in the eighties themselves I saw a lot of off the wall California acts of lesser fame (e.g. Holy Sisters of Gaga Dada, Ex Voto, Ethyl Meatplow)

'89 to '93 I saw a lot of cool stuff (Meat Beat Manifesto and KMFDM twice each, Dickies, Consolidated's Myth of Rock tour, Front 242, Gwar, and Sisters of Mercy's Vision Thing era line up).

Who liked Sex Gang Children and Alien Sex Fiend?

Oh duh. I almost forgot to mention Kraftwerk.

[thinairart]

Joy Division was alright... but I think looking beyond the tragedy of the death of Ian Curtis, they were just as influential and productive when Sumner moved to lead vocals and they changed their name to New Order. The funny thing about Joy Division is I still run into people today who say things like "its a shame Joy Division only made 2 albums"... as if the whole band died when Curtis killed himself.

[Kagemusha22]

The funny thing about Joy Division is I still run into people today who say things like "its a shame Joy Division only made 2 albums"... as if the whole band died when Curtis killed himself.

I guess people just really miss Ian's lyrics, the genius of Joy Division seems to be entirely credited to him. Even though Bernard Sumner was the one who wrote the music, Peter Hook and Stephen Morris were the one's playing the Bass and Drums (one of Joy Division's strong points), and Martin Hannet was the genius behind their sound and atmosphere.

Still New Order is more famous than Joy Division. I guess because the rest of the band moved on, people just attribute Joy Division singularly with Ian as the defining force.

[jubjubjedi]

I guess people just really miss Ian's lyrics, the genius of Joy Division seems to be entirely credited to him. Even though Bernard Sumner was the one who wrote the music, Peter Hook and Stephen Morris were the one's playing the Bass and Drums (one of Joy Division's strong points), and Martin Hannet was the genius behind their sound and atmosphere.

Still New Order is more famous than Joy Division. I guess because the rest of the band moved on, people just attribute Joy Division singularly with Ian as the defining force.

Joy Divison is still highly influential as well, especially among all the new "emo" type kids and whatever doom pop thing is going on these days.

Ian's lyrics definitely stand out as unique. But frankly, JD does not sound all too good live, at least from the various live recordings I've seen and heard. The quality of the studio albums' sound and the post-Ian romanticism and atmosphere have as much to do with the production values unique to those albums (Hannet, as mentioned above) as well as the competent musicianship.

Bands like Placebo, Interpol, and She Want's Revenge are so obviously influenced by JD, but they are so often fluff with no substance. She Want's Revenge noticeably stand out for their cringe-worthy lyrics.

[tomwaits4noman]

without trying to turn this into a Joy Division thread

a few points

reidaj- Joy Division did die with Ian Curtis. the band not only changed their name but radically altered their sound. New Order are not Joy Division they shared 3 members, nor should Joy Division be viewed as an Ian Curtis band, that is one of the reasons why the band refused to give interviews after their first few releases as they wanted the music to speak for its self but also rejected the fact that the press focused mainly on Ian. They saw themselves as a band, each member is key to their sound. As kagemusha22 has said in his post.

I think they are on a par its just that New Order are still releasing albums keeping them the public eye - or at least they were until Hooky came out in the press and said they had broken up. Joy Division should be noted as one of the first bands post punk to feature synth and drum machines they

jubjubjedi don't mention emo and Joy Division

there are plenty of decent bands inspired by Joy Division

a few -

Janes Addiction - Eric Avery said that Peter Hook inspired his bass playing
Billy Corgan - Smashing Pumpkins
Radiohead
U2
The Cure
R.E.M
Moby

I think New Order had more of an influence on the dance rave electronic scene than on the rock music scene.

In terms of live
have you the Le Bains Douche Joy Division live cd it sound pretty good, there is a myth that they were a studio band, that cd proves other wise, the problem is that there are not many professional recordings of their gigs,
The Preston cd and the Still live gig should be avoided they are not that great. also New Order are known for being hit and miss live too.

[kingshaj]

You had to be there...


but only for a decade...

although i too feel compelled to admit that i looked like live action anime.

[jubjubjedi]

jubjubjedi don't mention emo and Joy Division

there are plenty of decent bands inspired by Joy Division

a few -

Janes Addiction - Eric Avery said that Peter Hook inspired his bass playing
Billy Corgan - Smashing Pumpkins
Radiohead
U2
The Cure
R.E.M
Moby

I think New Order had more of an influence on the dance rave electronic scene than on the rock music scene.

In terms of live
have you the Le Bains Douche Joy Division live cd it sound pretty good, there is a myth that they were a studio band, that cd proves other wise, the problem is that there are not many professional recordings of their gigs,
The Preston cd and the Still live gig should be avoided they are not that great. also New Order are known for being hit and miss live too.

LOL, sorry about the dreaded word. Their popularity definitely seems to have saturated the modern scenesters, though.
You can add the Doves to the list of good JD inspired bands as well.
Regarding Le Bains Douche, I can't say that I've heard it... I take it that it's not in the box set? When was this released?

[Kagemusha22]

there are plenty of decent bands inspired by Joy Division

a few -

Janes Addiction - Eric Avery said that Peter Hook inspired his bass playing
Billy Corgan - Smashing Pumpkins
Radiohead
U2
The Cure
R.E.M
Moby



I don't know what it is that makes me have mixed-feelings about U2, I used to really enjoy listening to the Joshua Tree. The fact that they're one of the early 80's "Post-Punk" bands, is also cool. But when I look at any of the band members of U2, I just find them really irritating.

Still I love Radiohead (and the other acts you listed), any band that keeps churning out era defining albums like they do, deserves an award.

[tomwaits4noman]

LOL, sorry about the dreaded word. Their popularity definitely seems to have saturated the modern scenesters, though.
You can add the Doves to the list of good JD inspired bands as well.
Regarding Le Bains Douche, I can't say that I've heard it... I take it that it's not in the box set? When was this released?

2001 amazon review here http://www.amazon.com/Bains-Douches-18-December-1979/dp/B0002235MQ

no its not on the Heart and Soul boxset the again either is the full Peel Sessions or all of the Warsaw Era recorded sessions - worth checking out to here earlier versions of the songs and the impact of Martin Hannetts production only They Walked in Line is better in the earlier version.

yeah Kage, U2 piss me off too, I can understand why people might like them put their songs are far too preachy and arena anthem for my taste.

[Elwell]

Thought this was as good a place to post this as any:
Best South Park episode ever (http://www.southparkstudios.com/episodes/210813). (Or at least since Robert Smith vs. Mecha Barbra Striesand.)

[Kagemusha22]

One overlooked band for this thread....how about The Doors, Strange Days period. (Not exactly 80's or Post-Punk, but the sound textures, and mood for that album seem like a pretty apparent influence on Goth Rock)

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And then there's Echo & the Bunnymen, who've gone unmentioned.

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[Kian]

Elwell, I watched that last night, I was in tears. Brilliant episode.

[Kagemusha22]

Some Post-punk covers I found whilst rummaging through Youtube;

Bat for Lashes - A Forest (Cure song)

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The Cure - Love Will Tear Us Apart

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Radiohead - Headmaster Ritual

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[JackHatesJack]

So I was looking for covers of Cure songs the other day (I'm borderline obsessed with song covers) and found something I'm still not 100% decided on:
67BXnd8vNuM

I clicked on it expecting a trainwreck, but the actual music backing them up is pretty goddamn cool, especially the arrangement on In Between Days. (The animal mask thing is a pretty great bonus)

I dunno, I'm still a little disgusted with myself for being over 14 and enjoying something KoRn related.


Also, no love for Einstürzende Neubauten?

[Elwell]

From 1:45 to 3:30 that's really cool.
The rest, not so much.
In related multi-generational bizarreness, here's Peter Murphy, Trent Reznor, and TV on the Radio doing the Goth National Anthem:
xD7Cz6uwan8

[JackHatesJack]

Hahahaha nice. There used to be a really good video of Peter Murphy and Trent Reznor in studio covering Dead Souls by Joy Division, but every quality trace of this event seems to have been devoured, only shitty live footage remains. It was part of a pretty cool series of cover collabs between Murphy and Reznor and a revolving bunch of guests, which included:
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[Kagemusha22]

Krautrock, German music is cool and don't believe anyone who says otherwise. (Even people who have a justifiable allergic reaction to David Hasselhoff)

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