Need a colored pencil master to answer this question

[andymania]

I have been working and struggling with colored pencils for a few years now and I need to have someone who is advanced or an expert in colored pencils to answer these questions.

1. I have been using turpenoid and prismacolor pencils on stonehenge paper recently in order to get my drawings to look like paintings. When doing areas very light in value, how do I create very subtle details and slight changes in value? (such as a face in strong light with subtle changes in tone)These things are easy to control in graphite since graphite is powdery and it travels beautifully on paper, plus it can be modified with a kneaded eraser so you can create the moste subtle changes in value and detail. Now with colored pencils, if I put down a rather thick layer of light peach, go over it with turpenoid and then put a color darker in value with very light pressure, it doesnt go down on the paper that easily since colored pencils are wax based and the layer of light peach is already waxy. So drawing on top of areas that are light in value is very hard for me and I cant seem to do it.
Plus there is this ugly "speckled, blotchy" effect when I again go over the area with turpenoid. No matter how may times I relayer colors, add turpenoid, etc, I cant get my colored pencils to look beautiful and smooth like my graphite drawings. Any ideas as to what I need to do? I keep my pencils sharp, brush away any crumbs, and I do all the stuff the other colored pencil pros do but nothing works for me. Please help.

2.Is there a way to work subractively in colored pencils? The kneaded eraser doesnt lift wax up that well.

-Andy

[Shadowwing]

OKay...I don't claim myself as an expert with colored pencils, but I do a lot of work with them. Colored pencils work best on paper that has "teeth" to catch the color...the rougher the paper, the better and your colors will come off thicker. When you put on a thick layer of color, you have smoothed out all the "teeth" in the paper so any subsequent colors will just slide off and not leave much. Applying tupernoid makes it even more smooth and slippery. I don't think you are supposed to apply tupernoid until you are done and you are sure you won't need to add any more color.
I suggest that you layer your colors from dark to light, and don't color in the areas that you want to leave white. Do all the shading and lifting before you go over with tupernoid or using the blender pencil (a special pencil that blends the colors...Prismcolor has them). Does this help any?

[SandraAngelo]

I have been working and struggling with colored pencils for a few years now and I need to have someone who is advanced or an expert in colored pencils to answer these questions.

1. I have been using turpenoid and prismacolor pencils on stonehenge paper recently in order to get my drawings to look like paintings. When doing areas very light in value, how do I create very subtle details and slight changes in value? (such as a face in strong light with subtle changes in tone)These things are easy to control in graphite since graphite is powdery and it travels beautifully on paper, plus it can be modified with a kneaded eraser so you can create the moste subtle changes in value and detail. Now with colored pencils, if I put down a rather thick layer of light peach, go over it with turpenoid and then put a color darker in value with very light pressure, it doesnt go down on the paper that easily since colored pencils are wax based and the layer of light peach is already waxy. So drawing on top of areas that are light in value is very hard for me and I cant seem to do it.


Plus there is this ugly "speckled, blotchy" effect when I again go over the area with turpenoid. No matter how may times I relayer colors, add turpenoid, etc, I cant get my colored pencils to look beautiful and smooth like my graphite drawings. Any ideas as to what I need to do? I keep my pencils sharp, brush away any crumbs, and I do all the stuff the other colored pencil pros do but nothing works for me. Please help.

2.Is there a way to work subractively in colored pencils? The kneaded eraser doesnt lift wax up that well.

-Andy

Andy, I get Google alerts about people who talk about colored pencil so I noticed your post. I joined your site to post some art that would show you what I'm talking about.

If I may say so, you are taking the wrong approach. Using turpinoid with the colored pencil doesn't get the results you want. I am a portrait artist and author of numerous books, magazine columns and DVDS on colored pencil and used to host the International Colored Pencil Symposoum for 8 years so I've heard all the masters' secrets.

You need to use the hard lead pencils that will give you a nice even transition and gradually increase the pressure until you have blended the wax and burnished it.

I'm not sure how this site works but I posted some examples for you in the gallery section (I think) under Fine Art. However I can't find them on here now so not sure how to direct you. (I am better with colored pencils than technology.:confident )

Not sure what your social networking rules are as I didn't see any in the sign-up but if I'm allowed to say this... I have some free online videos that demonstrate what I'm talking about too...hope it's ok to post the url. http://www.discoverartwithsandra.com/level_5.cfm. Go there and click the Free Preview for Draw People with Colored Pencils.


Hope that helps.

SandraAngelo

[mwillustration]

hey andymania,

i used to use colored pencils alot for my color work, but work completely digitally now.
when i would do a colored pencil drawing, i would use a rough paper with a good tooth like has been said so that your color has something to grab onto.
since it does burnish so much when you've applied too much color you need to work gently in the beginning layers to get to where you wanna go.
also since it isn't really like painting and is more like drawing, i'd suggest working from lighter colors to darker not only in layering but when creating transitions.
with pencils its all additive so when you get too much color down using a lighter tone on a darker one isn't going to get you anywhere, so i'd say start light and work darker so that if you need to get even darker as you go along, even though there isn't much tooth left, the darker color will still show a bit on the lighter surface of color you've already set down.

it's been a while since i worked in colored pencils so i'm definitely not an expert, but hopefully that helps a bit.
also i wouldn't use any solvents at all as that could easily make things muddy.

the way i used to work, i would lay down all my color and wipe away the wax buildup with a clean dry paper towel or kleenex periodically since it tends to come to the surface after a while and the color looks different.
when completely done i would wipe away the wax buildup one last time and then seal the drawing with crystal clear which would keep the wax from coming to the surface anymore, make it so that you won't smudge it and keeps the vibrancy of your colors.

one other thought to consider...
if you're not completely married to colored pencils and would like more freedom and control over your color, i'd suggest working digitally with corel painter.
ever since i switched i won't go back to colored pencils for color work anymore.
but that's just my preference.
:)

good luck.

[mwillustration]

as for your second question about working subtractively with colored pencils, this technique might work, but i never really tried it with colored pencils... although it does work beautifully with graphite.

first you take a sheet of paper or any surface, and gesso it like you would a canvas. (if it's paper, gesso a large X on the back so it doesn't buckle too much) don't worry about being really smooth with it unless you want that look as the grooves and bumps will create a nice texture that will add dimension to the drawing. don't go too thick though, try to get an even coat in maybe two layers at most. you don't want huge hills and valleys.
then you cover the dried gesso with graphite or in this case colored pencil.
use a large stick and not a pencil as it'll take you forever to cover your surface.
once you've covered it completely then take a little mineral spirits (or some other solvent) on a cloth or paper towel and rub it over the surface to slightly dissolve the graphite or colored pencil to a smooth finish.
then to work subtractively you use differing grades of sand paper to take away your graphite or colored pencil. use rougher grades for larger more general areas and tighter more detailed areas with smoother grades, using steel wool for the most subtle and detailed areas.

i learned this technique from my drawing instructor in art school, Deb Rockman who also has a book out about art that is a great resource for drawing called "The Art of Teaching Art".
it's geared toward art teachers but has alot of info in it that is just as helpful to students.

to check out some of her work go to debrockman.com
here's a couple links to some work specifically done with this technique but using graphite:
http://debrockman.com/visions/
http://debrockman.com/waging/

click the images on left and if they say "graphite on gessoed paper" then this technique was used.

[Shadowwing]

mwillustration's technique is different from mine, but might just work. I prefer working from dark to light because colored pencils are semi-translucent...if you put lighter color over a dark one, it will show through. Also, when you go over dark color with light one, you are burnishing it in the process to make it more smooth and even. For flesh color, I would lay down Tuscon Red or medium dark for areas in shadow, and the really dark areas in brunt umber. It is sketched out just like you would do with graphite. Then burnish over with peach or lighter color...using progressively lighter color (or strokes) for areas in light. Then burnish the whole thing over with white...and it will end up looking more like oil painting.

I recommend the following books...they are excellent for learning how to do flesh tones in colored pencils.

http://www.amazon.com/Colored-Pencil-Portraits-Step-Step/dp/1581806396/ref=sr_1_7/102-5645833-0684112?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1189474490&sr=1-7
http://www.amazon.com/Draw-Portraits-Colored-Pencil-Photographs/dp/0891347623/ref=sr_1_17/102-5645833-0684112?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1189474583&sr=1-17